|Posted on Sunday, July 10, 2005 - 22:10: |
I have hypertonic platysma muscles in my neck. When i do certain movement such a puckering strands pop out.I got this as a residual from a brief spell of bell's palsy. The muscle is not sore at all, but is impeding full movement. Ive heard from some, acupuncture can release these symptoms. Is this true, and if so how.
|Posted on Monday, July 11, 2005 - 22:06: |
Well Ricky, acupuncture may help both for Bell's palsy and for these hypertonic muscles. It is well advised to treat this problem ASAP in order to enhance the chance of recovery.
Acupuncture has a very good effect in enhancing the circulation of energy and blood in places of stagnation. Bell's palsy, as well as its sequelae - such as your muscle problem - is a significant case of stagnation or impeded flow of energy and blood. Acupuncture stimulates the circulation thereby allowing better nourishment to the affected muscles, exactly what they need in order to recover.
|Posted on Tuesday, July 12, 2005 - 00:13: |
Thank u for your reply.
I probably havent made myself fully clear on the situation, its one year post my bp, initally ive attended acupuncture, where i also received "electro" acupuncture. Ive attended specialist clinic in manchester and was told all my the nerve has fully recovered. The hypertonus Im told is not nerve damage. but residual for people who had bp for over a period of 3months plus.
|Posted on Tuesday, July 12, 2005 - 09:29: |
Not right at all. Acupuncture, even after 3 months of BP, should have brought you to full recovery. There should not be "leftovers" such as hypertonic muscles, lest the initial problem has not been fully recovered.
Sometimes, electro-acupuncture is contra-indicated in Bell's palsy and may cause this phenomenon of stubborn hypertonicity. Your problem must be addressed by a very experienced specialist and if the clinic that you have been to can not solve the problem - look for a better one. As said above, if this problem persists for too long it might become irreversible.
|Posted on Tuesday, July 12, 2005 - 13:40: |
If i could direct u to web bp forums such as - the bell's palsy network, bell's palsy organisation- and brain talk communities.
There are many people here who have had symptoms of bp for over 3+ years, we are ALL told by or gps or neurologists that bp will go away in a matter of week, this is usually from the page of a textbook and simply not the case.
The guys in these forums used acupuncture either initally or further on as treatment, and have still yet to fully recover. Of these, the main reason to use acupuncture was to try and stimulate muscle movement as the nerve regrows.
Im not in that situation anymore, Im enquiring how or if acupuncture can help the hypertonus or resting tone in the platysma and to a lesser extent in the sterno-mastoid, and depressor-labai.
Two of the main residuals of bp is synkinesis and hypertonus.
Ive attended the Lindens CLinic in manchester who specialise in neurological disorders. They performed Biofeed-back on all the branches of the 7th cranial nerve and all show 100% strength signal, What needs addressing is the abnormal resting tone of certain muscles.
Thank u for your quick response
|Posted on Tuesday, July 12, 2005 - 16:49: |
I wonder who are those GPs... this is not only incorrect but basically misleading and a dangerous approach. BP may take several months to heal, sometimes it won't at all. Acupuncture, in most cases when applied during the first few months may take 10-30 days to heal when applied daily as it should.
There are many people here who have had symptoms of bp for over 3+ years, we are ALL told by or gps or neurologists that bp will go away in a matter of week
The guys in these forums used acupuncture either initally or further on as treatment, and have still yet to fully recover.
Could be. Acupuncture, unlike western medicine, may have considerably different results when applied by different practitioners. This is why I recommended to you to find a VERY experienced and recommended practitioner.
Ive attended the Lindens CLinic in manchester who specialise in neurological disorders. They performed Biofeed-back on all the branches of the 7th cranial nerve and all show 100% strength signal, What needs addressing is the abnormal resting tone of certain muscles
Well Ricky, sorry to disappoint you but these examinations do not reflect your problem. I have seen people with full scale facialis or BP that their tests were also 100% OK. We are speaking here in terms of Ch. med and not western medicine. Our concern is the flow of Chi (energy) and blood and how to restore its functionality. Sometimes it involves the nerves, sometimes not. Sometimes it involves a viral infection, and at other times it does not. These are not part of our diagnosis nor do they contribute in any way to the treatment. If you go to a clinic that bases its diagnosis on western medical modalities but gives you acupuncture as its chosen treatment procedure, you will most probably not take a full advantage in the possibilities embodied in traditional acupuncture.
|Posted on Tuesday, July 12, 2005 - 22:17: |
You were taking about electro- acupuncture earlier. My heart is sinking every time im thinkin of this now ive just recalled that when i started acupuncture about 3 weeks post bp, when i was finished a session, the side of the neck was sore and was tight, and i could feel a band just below the back of the jaw. This could be the cause of the limited extrusion or hypertonus in the neck i have now?, so my own pro active , eagerness to help my recovery, the acupuncturist has tightened the muscle up so much, that its never going to release?.
|Posted on Wednesday, July 13, 2005 - 12:46: |
Oh, with a proper treatment your muscle is definitely going to release. The reaction you describe is definitely a contra-indication for electrical stimulation.
|Posted on Wednesday, July 13, 2005 - 21:50: |
I have to thank you very much for your professional and swift insight.
At the moment Im not holding to much hope as it has been near a 12 months since i first noticed
that tightness,I did act promptly when i got bp and go to acupuncturist, but through no fault of my own my I might be stuck like this. Its a hard pill to swallow.
I was a bit scared to go back to acupuncture, but after attending numerous physiotherapist etc. that didnt work, i have no options left.
Ive started going go to acupuncture again recently somewhere else,is there any point? Is it too late to hope for any kind of muscle release?.
Once again I thank u for your quick helpful response.
|Posted on Wednesday, July 13, 2005 - 23:08: |
P.s what kind of treatment should i be looking for.
On my first session i attended in the new clinic, the needles where put- at the top my neck behind my ear,(affected Left side), in the muscle between my thumb and forefinger(left hand), and 2 on the inner side of my rist(right hand).
Can you tell me your thoughts on this, does this sound ok?
Its not that I mistrust the acupuncturist, its just after 13 months of spending thousands of pounds and building my hopes up,I want to make sure everything is going to go in the right direction, for once.!
|Posted on Friday, July 15, 2005 - 20:38: |
It is very difficult to answer your question Ricky. The choice of the acupuncture points may be correct, but this is not the case. The handling of the needles by the practitioner, the sensation you get during the treatment session, your feeling after the treatment, all these have great significance. And another thing: I am not sure I am reading correctly... did you actually go 13 months for acupuncture treatment? If this is the case, I am afraid you have been to a quack... Acupuncture for BP might take 2-8 weeks when administered properly. Anything beyond that is an exploitation of the patient's trust (and money).
I am afraid Ricky that I can't help you more on this topic. Just follow your instincts and common sense and try to find a traditional acupuncturist, preferably by recommendations of other patients.
|Posted on Wednesday, August 30, 2006 - 15:27: |
following this topic, I have a female patient about 55 years old who suffers from ticks and twitches on her right cheek. This happens a lot when she is upset or excited. Her pulse shows tension (somewhat wiry H. pulse) as well as wiry Liver pulse. I have been treating her as a Bell's palsy patient without significant results so far.
Any suuggestions that you may offer will be greatly appreciated.
|Posted on Thursday, August 31, 2006 - 19:45: |
You were correct Austin choosing to treat her basically as a Bell's palsy patient. I also take for granted that you have included points in order to soothe her liver and calm her Shen, as indicated by her pulse.
I would choose as main points for this case, this formula:
Li-4/ Li-11 = on the right side, to enhance circulation on the face.
Sj-17 to remove wind from the face (rt side)
Si-19 (through to G-2)/ Si-18 - to remove wind and relax the facial nerves.
Si-16 - window of sky point to balance head and body.
In such cases, i.e., facialis, munbness and twitching etc., I usually recommend to have a very careful and close range glance at your patient, and try to observe carefully the exact location of the phenomenon. Try to distinguish exactly to what meridian the problem is mostly associated, namely: Si/ St/ Sj etc. You can even try and mimic the tics and twitches by yourself (without allowing your patient see what you're doing of course...), in order to activate these regions on your own face, and have a sensation as to which meridian the problem can be mostly attributed.
The needle manipulations must be adequately performed in order to enhance blood and Qi circulation on the affected side of the face. Sometimes, warm needling can dramatically enhance the treatment.
Hope this helps.